KnowBrainer Speech Recognition
Decrease font size
Increase font size
Topic Title: Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?
Topic Summary:
Created On: 11/24/2020 01:21 AM
Status: Post and Reply
Linear : Threading : Single : Branch
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - harpalus - 11/24/2020 01:21 AM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - Mav - 11/24/2020 04:29 AM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - Lunis Orcutt - 11/24/2020 02:43 PM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - Steve Morris - 11/24/2020 06:31 PM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - Lunis Orcutt - 11/24/2020 07:22 PM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - harpalus - 11/24/2020 09:19 PM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - Lunis Orcutt - 11/25/2020 08:20 PM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - harpalus - 11/25/2020 10:53 PM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - Matt_Chambers - 11/26/2020 08:14 AM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - harpalus - 11/28/2020 02:17 AM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - Matt_Chambers - 11/28/2020 09:28 AM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - harpalus - 11/28/2020 11:55 PM  
 Is DPI 15 series simply incompatible with Microsoft 365?   - Lunis Orcutt - 11/29/2020 01:07 PM  
Keyword
 11/24/2020 01:21 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
harpalus
Advanced Member

Posts: 192
Joined: 10/05/2008

In July of last year I purchased a new computer because the computer I was then using had freeze after freeze after freeze with DPI 15 – or was it DPI 15.3 by then. My previous computer was also nearly 7 years old and I got a good price on the new unit. The new unit for several months worked perfectly with no freezes. I could even happily dictate into Microsoft Outlook without any freezes whatsoever. Then freezes began to gradually occur when I was using Microsoft Outlook. Eventually things got to a state where I could no longer have Microsoft Outlook open while I was dictating into Microsoft Word because when Outlook was open there would be freeze after freeze even while working with a different program. There were of course sometimes freezes within Microsoft Word (Microsoft 365 version) even when Outlook was not open.

 

My older computer was downgraded to a station used for surfing the Internet. That surfing did not involve using Microsoft 365. I realized recently that the older computer rarely freezes when I use DPI 15.6 to surf the web. I can issue mouse commands, put text into Microsoft edge or Google Chrome – hours can go by without a single freeze. After extensive surfing, the operation of DPI may slightly slow down, but that is easily fixed by restarting DPI. So the older computer that used to freeze and freeze and freeze when I was using Microsoft 365, got much better when it was no longer used for working with Microsoft 365. Microsoft 365 is still on the older unit but is not used in combination with DPI.

 

I don’t have much need to dictate into Excel but seem to remember reading that many people have problems with such dictation. I certainly have umpteen problems doing anything with DPI when Microsoft outlook is just open but not being used. If my understanding about Excel problems is correct, then on 2 different Dell XPS computers, there seem to be compatibility problems between DPI and Microsoft Outlook and Excel.



-------------------------

GaryN

 11/24/2020 04:29 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Mav
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 265
Joined: 10/02/2008

Hi!

 

Whenever I hear a report about Dragon problems aggreviating over time and blaming an integration in 3rd party applications (doesn't matter if Office or a Browser or anything else), I usually doubt the validity of this conclusion.

 

The way Dragon interacts with other applications is static. The exact same communication is being used when you perform your first dictation into Outlook or your thousandth dictation, so there's no degrading to explain more frequent problems.

If there's a certain constellation of text and selection in the target window that lets Dragon choke on a recognition, then this can usually be reproduced if you create the same environment on a different machine (although that's by no means an easy feat!).

 

But what does change over time (if you have ruled out failing hardware) is your user profile - depending on what exactly you dictate and correct Dragon modifies your profile more or less.

 

Because of that, I'd suggest you create a new user profile and try if these hangs/problems still occur (and with which frequency).

 

My best guess in these cases is that _something_ in your profile gets modified (from the outside you can't say if it's the acoustic model, the language model or anything else Nuance has put into the speaker profile) until a tipping point is being reached where problems start to appear.

 

Nuance's default remedy for any problem usually is to create a new user profile, because they know themselves that their profiles detoriate over time. I think that's also the reason why Nuance added a simple way to Dragon Medical Server (the server behind DMO) to reset a user profile to default.

 

Please let us know if your freezes disappear if you use a new profile.

 

hth,

mav

 11/24/2020 02:43 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Lunis Orcutt
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 38357
Joined: 10/01/2006

Originally posted by: harpalus

In July of last year I purchased a new computer because the computer I was then using had freeze after freeze after freeze with DPI 15 – or was it DPI 15.3 by then. 

 



Ver. 15.3 was not compatible with Microsoft 365 (Outlook 2019) but the freezing problems should have stabilized with the release of Ver. 15.61, which also supports Outlook 2019. As to your current freezing problem, as Mav noted, we also recommend creating a new user profile



-------------------------

Forum Mission Statement
Trial Downloads
Dragon/Sales@KnowBrainer.com 
(615) 884-4558 ext 1



 11/24/2020 06:31 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Steve Morris
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 210
Joined: 07/22/2007

Hi. What is this Ver 15.61 of which you speak? I don't see it for DPG 15 in the portal to download. Is this something you have heard is coming?

-------------------------

 


 


Steve 

 11/24/2020 07:22 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Lunis Orcutt
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 38357
Joined: 10/01/2006

Sorry, when we referred to Ver. 15.61, we were alluding to DPI only. The latest version of DPG is still 15.6 but Nuance will be releasing DPG 15.61 soon. Just keep checking the portal

-------------------------

Forum Mission Statement
Trial Downloads
Dragon/Sales@KnowBrainer.com 
(615) 884-4558 ext 1

 11/24/2020 09:19 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
harpalus
Advanced Member

Posts: 192
Joined: 10/05/2008

I went through several cycles of creating new user profiles. When those new user profiles did not fix things, I removed DPI from my computer through the add or remove programs part of Windows, used the nuance tool for removing DPI, reinstalled DPI, created yet another brand-new profile, and observed the same freezing problems if Microsoft outlook was open. I several times removed Microsoft 365 from the computer, getting help from Microsoft technicians to be sure it was totally removed, reinstalled it, remove DPI again as described above, created a new user, and had the same problems. The above was on the computer purchased in July of last year. As stated above my nearly 7 year old computer that no longer is used with Microsoft 365 does not have freezes but it did have freezes before it was retired to a use that did not involve using Microsoft 365.

For both my current computer (one purchased in July of last year) and the older computer (before it was retired from using office), I set up the task manager on one of my three monitors connected to the computer. I then adjusted the task manager so that it sorted tasks by the amount of CPU use per task. When DPI was active, but I was not dictating, CPU use was very low for DPI. When Microsoft outlook was open but I had not yet dictated into another program with DPI, the CPU used by Outlook was extremely low. If I started to dictate into another program such as Microsoft Word while Microsoft outlook was open but was not being used, a freeze would soon occur. The CPU use by DPI would go up to about 29% and shortly afterwards the CPU used by Outlook would go up to about 29%. The freeze would go on and on. Most often the way I would get rid of the freeze was by killing the Outlook task. That would result in DPI use of the CPU going down in a moment or two and returning to a normal very low level when I was not dictating.

Again, the above sequence of CPU use occurred in both the old and the July 2019 purchased computer. With a July 2019 purchased unit, if I remember to never ever dictate into a program when Outlook is open, freezes are rare.

In addition to all of the above for both the old and the newer computer I more than once wiped the solid-state drive and reinstalled Windows 10 from scratch, reinstalled all my programs, settings, etc., created new users, and so forth. Not even wiping out Windows 10 and starting from scratch fixed the freezing problems that occur if Outlook is open.

For the above reasons I have problems believing that the problem is a defective user profile. Two different computers that were built several years apart have showed the same freezing problems when Outlook is open and I am dictating into a different program. Creating new profiles, reinstalling DPI, reinstalling Windows 10 do not fix the problems. I just realized that an interesting test might be to start Outlook and remove the DPI extension and see if that allows Outlook to be open without causing freezes while I dictate into a different program. Microsoft Word is not the only program into which I cannot safely dictate while Outlook is open but not being used. At the moment I have to use my hands for anything that I do in Microsoft outlook. If I want to reply to an email, I have to quit Outlook, start another program such as Microsoft Word, dictate my reply into that program, copy my reply, restart Outlook, manually open up the email to which I will reply, paste in the reply using my hands, send the reply using my hands. I have several disabilities with my hands and arms making it painful to do the manual work with Outlook and also running the risk of making things worse for my hands. The freezing situation is incredibly frustrating. I can remember when freezes never occurred on my older computer when I was using Outlook to do things totally hand free.

-------------------------

GaryN

 11/25/2020 08:20 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Lunis Orcutt
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 38357
Joined: 10/01/2006

Disabling the Outlook Dragon extension should work but you would be sacrificing Outlook Active Accessibility and Select-&-Say. If you dictate much email, you will miss this feature. Also note that it's very difficult to disable the Outlook Dragon extension and you may have to remove it completely. This is equivalent to throwing out the baby with the bathwater. We can assure you that Dragon is not the problem.

What we can tell you is that very few end-users are experiencing this problem. We use Microsoft Edge, Outlook, Word, Excel 2019 (Microsoft 365) all the time without these problems. It seems like you have tested everything except possibly searching for a unique Word extension or utility. This is the only thing we could think of.

This probably goes without saying but would you mind verifying that you are using Ver. 15.61? You'll find this information under the About Dragon menu under the DragonBar Help menu.



-------------------------

Forum Mission Statement
Trial Downloads
Dragon/Sales@KnowBrainer.com 
(615) 884-4558 ext 1



 11/25/2020 10:53 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
harpalus
Advanced Member

Posts: 192
Joined: 10/05/2008

Yes, I am using DPI 15.61.200.010. At this point I am starting to wonder if there is another email program that I could control with DPI. I really like Outlook if it was not totally incompatible with DPI on 2 different computers. Thanks for your thoughts about this situation.

-------------------------

GaryN

 11/26/2020 08:14 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Matt_Chambers
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 309
Joined: 08/09/2018

I've done some searching and have not found any other email programs that are compatible with Dragon. I use Outlook 2019 with DPI 15.6.1 without problem. I dictate directly into emails and into calendar entries. I'm using the locally installed version of Outlook 2019, however.

 11/28/2020 02:17 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
harpalus
Advanced Member

Posts: 192
Joined: 10/05/2008

Thanks Matt for the information. My outlook is also locally installed on my computer as opposed to being on the Internet. Difficult to know what is going on.

-------------------------

GaryN

 11/28/2020 09:28 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Matt_Chambers
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 309
Joined: 08/09/2018

Do you have other add-ins besides Natspeak installed in Outlook (look at File, Options, Add-ins)? Maybe one of them conflicts with the Dragon add-in?

 11/28/2020 11:55 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
harpalus
Advanced Member

Posts: 192
Joined: 10/05/2008

No other add-ins. Just now I opened up Outlook and after looking for additional add-ins, disabled the DPI add-in to see what happens with it disabled.

-------------------------

GaryN

 11/29/2020 01:07 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message

Author Icon
Lunis Orcutt
Top-Tier Member

Posts: 38357
Joined: 10/01/2006

Originally posted by: harpalus Just now I opened up Outlook and after looking for additional add-ins, disabled the DPI add-in to see what happens with it disabled.


You might be able to stabilize Outlook but there is a very good chance that you won't be able to dictate and if you can, you will not have Select-&-Say. Furthermore, Outlook usually re-enables the Dragon Add-in when you reopen it. The only way to prevent the Add-in is if you remove it; which we strongly recommend against. Disabling the Outlook Dragon add-in, might work for test purposes. If necessary, you can optionally open Outlook as the Administrator, to control the add-in behavior.



-------------------------

Forum Mission Statement
Trial Downloads
Dragon/Sales@KnowBrainer.com 
(615) 884-4558 ext 1



Statistics
31887 users are registered to the KnowBrainer Speech Recognition forum.
There are currently 2 users logged in.
The most users ever online was 12124 on 09/09/2020 at 04:59 AM.
There are currently 574 guests browsing this forum, which makes a total of 576 users using this forum.

FuseTalk Standard Edition v4.0 - © 1999-2021 FuseTalk™ Inc. All rights reserved.